Questions about your Christianity:Correspondence Between Grace Harris And Deke BarkerFebruary, 2004 |
From: Grace Harris
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004
Subject: Questions about your ChristianityDeke:
I'm just curious, and have never had the chance to ask these questions. I know you say you are Christian, of the liberal sort. I don't know what church you attend.
In your opinion, what makes a person a Christian?
Why are you a Christian?
Why should anyone convert to Christianity?
GraceFrom: Deke Barker
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004
Subject: Questions about your ChristianityGrace:
I usually attend a United Church of Christ (Congregationalist) congregation near my house, sometimes a Presbyterian church near the ASU campus. I grew up in the Christian Church / Disciples of Christ. All three denominations have been in off-and-on talks (COCU -- Council on Christian Unity) for 40-50 years. In Arizona, at times they have cooperated closely with each other in locating and building new churches. If I could find a nearby DofC congregation that I liked, I'd probably attend it.
As for the rest of your questions, you're asking the wrong person if you expect a quick and comprehensive answer. My religious beliefs are rather complex. As simply as I can put it:
What is a Xian? A short, no doubt inadequate answer would be that a Xian is one who believes in Xian teachings about the *NATURE* of God and man, and in Jesus' moral and ethical teachings. Belief in Pauline and/or Johannine doctrines, much less the church-created dogmas of later centuries, does not a "true" Xian make, nor does disbelief or ambivalence disqualify one from being a "true" Xian. Rather the contrary: excessive emphasis on proper doctrine leads one *AWAY* from true Xianity.
I'm a Xian for the same reason that 99% of Xians are Xians (same with Jews, Muslims, etc.): I was born into Xianity, in my case to a family of very devout, activist Xians.
I would encourage people to study the Xian perspective on God and man, and Jesus' understanding of morals and ethics. I would suggest that the combination represents the best route to a humane life on earth and (if it exists) to an afterlife in Heaven. But I would absolutely *NOT* insist that it is the "only way". God may be perverse, at least within the limits of human understanding, but she's not a complete asshole.
That do?
From: Grace Harris
Date: Monday, February 23, 2004
Subject: Questions about your ChristianitySo, you would say you accept the gospels, not as historical records, but because they contain the teachings of Jesus. On the other hand, you pretty much reject the rest of the New Testament, and any parts of the gospels you decide aren't really Jesus' teachings?
I'm just trying to clarify where you are coming from. Trust me, I won't pounce on you. I may or may not include you in the "Christian camp" in my own way of thinking, but I'm not the pouncing sort, unless you are an extraordinarily attractive single man half naked in the next room. In most ways I'm your typical Catholic, but as Shlomoh knows, I gots my special secret heresies. I'm not trying to set you up for the kill. :)
Do you reject the creeds, then, since you reject the historical church? For example, do you believe or disbelieve in the resurrection, or perhaps find it utterly irrelevant?
What is the Christian concept of the nature of God, according to you?
What is the Christian concept of the nature of man, according to you?
Thank you for replying. It's helping me get to know you better.
Grace
From: Deke Barker
Date: Monday, February 23, 2004
Subject: Questions about your ChristianityGrace:
No, that's not at all what I said.
Like many Xians, you seem to be looking at the NT as a combination of historical facts and lists of dogmas. I look at the NT as a guide, a continuation of the Biblical quest to understand God and man. I don't accept or reject any part of the NT or the Tanakh. I simply take what each part has to offer and consider it with the whole. That the Church later turned much of the NT into dogma is, IMO, unfortunate, as the most important parts of Xianity tend to get buried in largely-irrelevant doctrinal disputes.
I mentioned the doctrines of Paul and John. What I really meant was the doctrines of Paul and John *AS SUBSEQUENTLY INTERPRETED AND APPLIED* by the Church. Paul expected an imminent parousia, and his writings reflect that expectation. The parousia has yet to arrive after 2000 years, so naturally there are some aspects of Paul's teachings that cannot be thoughtfully applied to contemporary circumstances. Same with all of the books of the Bible. (You into stoning adulteresses? Had pork recently? Will you allo w any future husband to have dominion over you? Do you think that everyone who was not "born again" will go to Hell? How about Gandhi?)
If people would be honest with themselves, what I do is no different from what most Xians do. We pick and choose. If we don't like a Bible passage, we ignore it, pretend it doesn't exist. And many of us will still in all seriousness proclaim that we believe every word of the Bible to be inerrant. The big difference is that I am doing so consciously, and I am *NOT* rejecting things just because they are inconvenient.
As for doctrines: Sure, I believe in the resurrection *AS A CATALYST AND SYMBOL OF XIANITY AND WHAT JESUS MEANT TO USE*. Does that mean that I think Jesus was physically lifted up to heaven? No.
I don't reject the possibility of a physical resurrection -- we're talking about the Infinite, so how can one reject anything -- but I do see the physical resurrection as a belief consistent with 1st century Greco-Roman and Near Eastern thought and understanding, not our own. The *MEANING* of the stories, whether or not they are factual in terms of natural history, is what is important. The sacrifice, and the fact that the sacrifice was for *ALL* people, not just the select few.
Other doctrines, dogmas, creeds? The Xian church is a living institution. If its adherents worship fossils for the sake of tradition, IMO they are not practicing Xianity. The Bible needs to be interpreted as if its "rules" were a hierarchical pyramid. The rules at the top, the basic foundation of Xian morals and ethics, are inviolable. The further down the pyramid one goes, the more the rules have to be understood in their sitz im leben (situation in life). This applies as much to theological revelation (th e Trinity) as it does to moral laws (theft). Doctrinal beliefs tend to become ossified, especially after 1900 years. To the extent that they remain relevant and consistent with the top of the pyramid, I accept them. If they are no longer relevant or consistent, I mostly ignore them except for their value as historical artifacts.
God is the top of the pyramid. Man, a product of Nature outside of that pyramid, serves God by serving Man in light of that pyramid.
From: Grace Harris
Date: Thu, Mar 4 2004
Subject: Questions about your ChristianityDeke,
I think you misunderstand my questions. I realize you are not an inerrantist. Neither am I. I believe those who wrote the many books of the Bible were inspired, NOT dictated to word for word, meaning that what truths they recorded were of course filtered through their personalities and cultural upbringing. The reason we have a collection of books we call "The Bible" is because the Bishops of the church determined that these books reflected church beliefs and orthodoxy. Thus...Canon. To get technical, I 'm asking you what your canon is, since you obviously don't accept all of the Bible.
And yes, I realize you are not trying to interpret away things on the basis of convenience, at least not consciously. I think you interpet scripture based on what you have learned from scholarship, and through the principal of the Golden Rule. And let's face it, we ALL (including inerrantists) have a tendency to read into scripture things we emotionally need to be there. At any rate, I often play the devils advocate and defend liberals to rather scornful conservatives who cannot imagine anything other th an selfish motivation.
Grace Harris converted to Roman Catholicism from Holiness Religion over 20 years ago.
Deke Barker is a member of the church of The Disciples Of Christ.
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