How To Talk To Those Silly Jesus MissionariesBy Shlomoh
December 15, 2011
Governor Perry of Texas is being silly again. No, as a matter of fact, he is being stupid again, and his stupidity takes the same form as it took when George W. Bush was being stupid. It's all about the J man, or as I call Yeshua, brother J.
Perry says he is not ashamed to say that he is a Christian. Wow! I know so many people who say they are ashamed to be Jews! But at least that's understandable. Jews have gotten a raw deal from Christians for many years. When I was 6, a little Catholic boy told me that the Jews killed God. I thought, Oh so that's why we can't see Him. He's a ghost. Well in Christianity, part of Him is a ghost, a ghost that you can't see, as Gordon Lightfoot used to say.
Well now Christmas is upon us once again. You remember Christmas. In case you don't, it's the holiday on which the guards at Auschwitz sat around singing songs about a make believe little Jewish baby while they were baking REAL Jewish babies in the oven instead of Yule cake.
Be that as it may, the new thing among those wild and crazy Christians is that Christmas, the GOYISH version of CHANUKAH, is under attack. It is? What, he can't observe
Christmas? Is the Grinch alive and kicking? Everywhere you look, there's Christmas. What's he talking about? No, Jews are under attack, attack from those silly little men and women who think they know the Jews' religion better than Jews know it. It has do be the most CHUTSPADIK claim ever made.
And when do you hear that extraordinary claim? When the Christian is trying to tell the Jew he is on the wrong track, and he tells the Jew that his ignorant "legalistic" religion will lead him straight to hell, AND that's why it's important for that Christian to missionize Jews, and put them on the right track. Jews have had to put up with that ignorant and insulting hogwash for many years. Yes, it is hogwash so it's TREYF. The message is that once a Jew accepts the Nazarene magician as the messiah, he is "completed." So I have to ask: Am I really incomplete? What do they expect? ..... that my foreskin will grow back once I accept the MAMZER? I know that there once was a real Jewish man who lived in Galilee and taught TORAH to his fellow Jews and was executed as a rebel against Rome. But that's not the guy they are talking about. No, the one they are talking about is the guy hanging on the wall. In fact, that guy isn't even a real person. He's either a baby lying in a manger or a guy dying on a cross. He's usually not a living Jewish person with something valuable to say.
So the silly little missionary will tell a Jew that he has to be "saved" or go to Hell when he dies. And their view of salvation is believing that someone who lived and died long ago was and is the Jewish messiah and Jews are simply too ignorant, willful, stiff necked, blind, diabolical or [you fill in other adjectives] to accept the truth. And from whom do they get this pernicious idea? From the Tarsian Charlatan historically known as Saul of Tarsus, and later, Paul the Apostle. We prefer Paul the
APOSTATE. But Paul can only be called an apostate if he were Jewish, and we have no definitive proof that he was. And if he was, he disassociated himself from Jewishness soon after beginning his benighted mission.
First let me say a few things about the "professional" antimisisonaries like Rabbi Tuvia Singer.
Tuvia Singer is an is an Orthodox rabbi who engages Christian missionaries in religious debates revolving around verses in the Bible which are supposedly prophecies of the coming of Christ. He argues that the verses they quote do not have the correct Jewish interpretation and are mostly bad translations from the original Hebrew. He's quite good at what he does so long as he is arguing with Christian missionaries trying to convert Jews. But his methods and arguments are the same ones used by Jews since the time of RAMBAM back in the 14th century when Jews were FORCED into religious debates about the messiahship of Jesus by the church or king.
You can download his lectures at http://torahanytime.com/rabbi_singer.html. They are really informative and interesting only in an academic sense.
So these religious fights between Christians and knowledgeable Jews have been going on for hundreds of years and they are useless for ordinary modern Jews to utilize because the Christian missionaries have been using them for years and also have been building up counter arguments to whatever rebuttals the Jew may have. And frankly, Biblical verses are NOT what convince a Jew to accept Jesus. They are merely the icing on the cake, the cake being the Jew's already listening and leaning into belief in Jesus as the Jewish messiah. Arguments with a gentile over a book which is the Jewish book, and one badly translated into a non-Jewish language at that, are self-defeating. This is not the way to go because the poor Jew winds up defending his own scripture against an arrogant and ignorant gentile who is telling the Jew that he knows the Jewish scripture better than the Jews know it. The TANACH needs no defense.
Jews need not go on the defense but on the attack! Better yet, the COUNTER-attack from the missionary because make no mistake, an attempt by a gentile missionary to get a Jew to accept the gentile's religion IS an attack on the whole Jewish People. So what will a Jew attack? Why the CHRISTIAN scripture of course! Tell the missionary you want to discuss what's in HIS book, not yours. And there is plenty to talk about there.
The following paragraphs are meant to give you an idea of what the silly little missionaries will tell a Jew and how a Jewish person can respond to the missionizing message most effectively.
Paul wrote many letters to gentiles whom he had convinced to become Christians. He wrote a letter to the church in the city of Corinth where Jewish followers of the real Yeshua had come to tell Corinthian Christians that if they wanted to be real followers of Yeshua, they'd have to become real Jews. In the letter, he stated,
"Are they Hebrews? So am I. Are they Israelites? So am I. Are they Abraham´s descendants? So am I. Are they servants of Christ? (I am out of my mind to talk like this.) I am more." 2 [Corinthians 11:22,23] His statement that he is more of a Jew than anyone who was a disciple of the actual Yeshua began to set him against, not only J's Jewish followers but against Jews in general. His letters contain some of the most anti-Jewish statements ever written, and these statements allegedly spoken by a Jew.
It's hard to believe that any committed Jew would speak to gentiles about his co-coreligionists who want to these gentiles to be Jewish, and say to them, "But I would also wish that those who trouble you would be (genitally) cut off " [Galatians 5:12]. The meaning is clear: May the Jews who want you to be circumcised be genitally mutilated themselves! He is referring to Yeshua's Jewish disciples who also approached Paul's Galatian converts, telling them to convert to the TORAH.
It is important to hear several other things that Paul said to the gentiles he deceived and duped.
"A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the spirit, not by the written code." [Romans 2:28,29] So way before Eichmann decided to define who is a Jew, this other Charlatan beat him to it. The statement buttresses his claim to the Corinthian Christians that they need not become circumcised Jews since they are already Jews inwardly and by the spirit. The obvious end to this thought is that a person [gentile] can CLAIM to be Jewish but lead his life as a non-Jew. And how do Christians lead their lives? They themselves say that they are gentiles. Jews are an unknown and suspicious element in their minds.
And here is an important followup to his previous statement to the Corinthians found in 2 Corinthians 5:16 ...
First, the King James version -
"Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more."
And then the New International Version -
"So from now on we regard no one from a worldly point of view. Though we once regarded Christ in this way, we do so no longer."
While the Jews who knew Yeshua acknowledged that he was a human being, Paul told his gentile followers to disregard the humanity of his Jesus and thereby the
Jewishness of Jesus.
These verses only serve to highlight the rest of his message to gentile Christians, that is, to reject and remove themselves spiritually and religiously from Jews and from the Jewish religion.
Many have noted that even if Paul actually had ever been Jewish, he had renounced his Jewish identity by living with and living like a gentile.
Paul, throughout his writings, strongly identifies with gentiles as a gentile by his constant use of the pronoun "we" which includes himself and the gentiles following him.
This is expressed strongly in his letter to the Galatians -
"And now that the way of faith has come, we no longer need the TORAH as our guardian." [Galatians 3:25]
The question to missionaries, when they say that "we" are no longer under the TORAH, is, When were YOU gentiles EVER obligated to the TORAH? Never! Because to say that a person is not obligated to or under the TORAH is to say that the person is not Jewish. Even those Jews least committed to a TORAH lifestyle on a day to day basis acknowledge that the TORAH is their religion.
The fact that Paul wanted everyone to turn into gentiles is addressed in chapter 21 in the New Testament book called Acts Of The Apostles. Here there is a description of Paul's trip to Jerusalem for an audience with James [YAKOV], the brother of Yeshua who has assumed leadership of the Nazarene sect.
"When we arrived at Jerusalem, the brothers and sisters received us warmly. The next day Paul and the rest of us went to see James, and all the elders were present. Paul greeted them and reported in detail what God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. When they heard this, they praised God. Then [James] said to Paul: 'You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed [in Yeshua], and all of them are zealous for the TORAH. They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs. What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have made a vow. Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know there is no truth in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the TORAH."
Acts 21:17-24 -
James challenges Paul and gives him a direct order to go to the Temple and participate in an act of sacrifice My question is this. Are the Christians reading these verses aware that James is asking Paul to act in contradiction to what he preaches? After all, if Paul went around telling gentiles [and apparently Jews also] that
the TORAH no longer is in effect, and that the sacrificial system is obsolete, then James is ordering Paul to PUBLICALLY act in direct contradiction to what he preaches
"The next day Paul took the men and purified himself along with them. Then he went to the Temple to give notice of the date when the days of purification would end and the offering would be made for each of them."
Acts 21:26 -
While Paul is in the diaspora, among his gentiles, he can contradict and insult Yeshua's Jewish disciples. But now that he is in their midst, in Jerusalem, he feels compelled to give in to whatever James and the other Jewish leaders tell him. This is only one example of Paul's hypocrisy. Among other things, Paul was a duplicitous hypocrite.
"Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the TORAH I became like one under the TORAH though I myself am not under the TORAH, so as to win those under the TORAH. To those not having the TORAH I became like one not having the TORAH though I am not free from God´s TORAH but am under Christ´s TORAH, so as to win those not having the TORAH. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I HAVE BECOME ALL THINGS TO ALL PEOPLE so that by all possible means I might save some."
1 Corinthians 9:19-23, New International Version
Paul became all things to all people, a cynical, hypocritical religious chameleon, who admits openly that he is NOT under the obligation of the TORAH, hence an apostate from the Jewish People.
There is an interesting coda to the story of Paul in Jerusalem before James, the significance of which I don't think has been picked up by most Christians [who don't usually delve into the depths of their scriptures anyway].
Paul came to Jerusalem in 57 CE and presented himself before James, supreme head of the Nazarene sect. Acts Of The Apostles, edited to smooth out the conflicts between him and the Nazarenes, reports that he was warmly received. James chides him about reports that he is encouraging Jews and gentiles to disregard the TORAH. In order to embarrass Paul, James orders him to bring a sacrifice to the Temple, thereby PUBLICLY validating that the commandments of the TORAH are to be obeyed. But certain men at the Temple see him and try to kill him.
"And when the seven days were almost ended, the Jews which were of Asia, when they saw him in the temple, stirred up all the people, and laid hands on him, crying out, Men of Israel, help: This is the man, that teacheth all men every where against the people, and the TORAH, and this place [the Temple]."
Acts 21: 27-28
The men are about to kill Paul when several Roman soldiers arrive and rescue him. Jews who are present complain to the Roman commanding officer that Paul is a lawbreaker although Acts doesn't specify just what they charged him with, But apparently they convinced the Romans that he was dangerous both to Jews and to the Empire.
The Roman officer binds him and orders him to be taken to jail. Whatever it was that Paul was accused of by those Jews, it was serious enough that the Romans
ordered him to be scourged. Paul protests to the officer that he is a Roman citizen and that it is not lawful to bind a Roman citizen. The officer apologizes and leads Paul off to jail. While he is sitting in his cell, waiting for judgment, he hears that "certain of the Jews banded together, and bound themselves under a curse, saying that they would neither eat nor drink till they had killed Paul." [Acts 23:12]. Most likely these men were Zealots or Sicarii, professional Galilean Jewish hit-men adept at kidnapping and assassinating. The Romans, hearing about the plot to lynch Paul, remove him from Jerusalem and bring him to Caesarea, the Roman capital of Judea.
He was held as a prisoner for two years in Caesarea until a new governor reopened his case. Jewish officials appear before the governor and accuse Paul of treason, the details of this accusation are omitted by the author of Acts. Since he has been accused by Jews, the Romans ask him if he is willing to go to Jerusalem and be judged by a Jewish court. Paul reminds the Roman officer that he is a Roman citizen, and as such, prefers to be judged by a court in Rome presided over by Caesar himself. Paul is taken to Rome where again spends two years waiting for his trial date to come up. Here Acts Of The Apostles ends, not telling the reader the disposition and conclusion of the case.
Neither the New Testament nor any historical document tells how or when Paul died. According to Christian tradition, Paul was beheaded in Rome during the reign of Nero around the mid-60s.
Since I entitled this essay HOW TO TALK TO JESUS MISSIONARIES, you're possibly wondering why I devoted so much time to Paul and none to Jesus. I'll get to Jesus in due time. I think it's important first to realize that the man who INVENTED the Christian religion was himself a nasty, untrustworthy, lying individual who created his own religion for gentiles because Jews would not listen to him. Yes, Paul, NOT Yeshua, invented Christianity, and its message and the historical behavior of its adherents are a testament to its creator. So if Jews are approached by Christian missionaries, it's important to know about the person who composed Christianity's animus to Jews and TOARH. Why else would they say that the TORAH is void and that Jews need to change who they are, unless the subtext of the missionaries' message is that Jews and Judaism are less than OK. After all, in his message to his gentiles in Thessalonia, Paul said:
"You suffered from your own people the same things those churches suffered from the Jews who killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets and also drove us out. They displease God and are hostile to all people in their effort to keep us from speaking to the gentiles so that they may be saved. In this way they always heap up their sins to the limit."
1 Thessalonians 2:14-16
The story of Paul's arrest and imprisonment is interesting more for what it it does not say. James publicly humiliates Paul by making him go to the Temple to offer a sacrifice. When he gets there, there are already men in place who charge him to kill him. He is saved by Romans and arrested and spends a total of four years in prison after refusing to be tried by a Jewish court. Who were the men waiting for him at the Temple? Were they a hit squad set up by James? In other words, did the Nazarenes take out a contract on Paul? It appears strange that during the four years of his lockup, no Jewish follower of Yeshua tries to help him or even comes to visit him.
From the time of his arrest to the time of his death, his only contacts are with gentiles. All Jews, including Nazarenes, appear to have written him off as no longer a threat, and ignored him. By the way, there is a strong Jewish tradition about solving Jewish issues in a Jewish court. When a Jew is asked to choose which court he will be heard by, a Jewish or a gentile one, and he chooses a gentile court, he is called a MOSER. This Hebrew term means "one who hands over", a Jew who has voluntarily handed himself over to gentile authorities when he could have placed himself under the jurisdiction of Jewish authorities.
To review, this man attempted to nullify the TORAH, and he changed his Jewish name Saul to a gentile name Paul; he identified with gentiles more than with Jews; he excoriated Jews who wanted gentiles to convert to Judaism, even the real followers of Yeshua. He was not interested in their sect or in the real, human, Jewish man.
"Further, my brothers and sisters, rejoice in the lord! ... Watch out for those DOGS, THOSE EVILDOERS, THOSE MUTILATORS OF THE FLESH. If someone else thinks they have reasons to put confidence in the flesh, I have more: circumcised on the eighth day, of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; in regard to the TORAH, a Pharisee; as for zeal, persecuting the church; as for righteousness based on the law, faultless. But whatever were gains to me I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage" [SKUBALA].
According to the page at http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=skubala, SKUBALA is a Greek word that is the equivalent to the modern English word "shit." SKUBALA is a rare word, used only in Philippians 3:8 in the New Testament. Dung, rubbish, refuse, and a loss are various inaccurate translations of the Greek word. No translation accurately translates this term to its modern English equivalence: "shit." The word means "excrement" either animal or human. It is a very strong word!
Imagine, to top off all other things said so far, this Apostate calls Jews DOGS, EVILDOERS, MUTILATORS OF THE FLESH. Then he goes on to call his Jewishness and the TORAH a nasty Greek word. This is really the essence of who he was. And by the way, who he was by his own self-definition cannot be proven. His claim to be of the tribe of Benjamin is preposterous. By the first Christian century, Jews, apart from Levites, no longer knew the tribal origin of their ancestors. It is doubtful that he was a Pharisee or that he was even really Jewish. Kaufmann Kohler, a Jewish New Testament scholar says that Paul was not a Hebrew scholar but a Hellenist. He writes,
"Nor is there any indication in Paul's writings or arguments that he had received the rabbinical training ascribed to him by Christian writers, ancient and modern; least of all could he have acted or written as he did had he been, as is alleged (Acts xxii. 3), the disciple of Gamaliel I ... His quotations from Scripture, which are all taken, directly or from memory, from the GREEK VERSION, [LXX] BETRAY NO FAMILIARITY WITH THE ORIGINAL HEBREW TEXT. The Hellenistic literature, such as the Book of Wisdom and other Apocrypha, as well as Philo [the Greek Jewish philosopher] ... was the sole source for his eschatology and theological system. Notwithstanding the emphatic statement ... that he was 'a Hebrew of the Hebrews' a rather unusual term, which seems to refer to his nationalistic training and conduct ... since his Jewish birth is stated in the preceding words 'of the stock of Israel' he was, if any of the Epistles that bear his name are really his, ENTIRELY A HELLENIST IN THOUGHT AND SENTIMENT. His whole state of mind shows the influence of the theosophic or Gnostic lore of Alexandria."
In other words, Kohler is telling us that Paul's outlook was thoroughly Greek [gentile]. So how can any Jew trust him to teach anything AUTHENTICALLY Jewish. And this is the Apostate who created the gentile religion known as Christianity.
Now simply ask your friendly gentile missionary why on earth you would want to join a people and a religion which say that you and your people are contrary to the human race and are displeasing to God? And don't let them confuse you by doubletalk. Their own scriptures say what they say. And if they tell you that the verses only refer to the Jews who were harassing Paul, tell them that's not what the verse say. It says "suffered from THE Jews" - the definite article THE means ALL. All Jews killed Christ and all displease God.
So who was this monster who caused extreme gentile hatred to Jews which we know as Christian antisemitism, leading to the Holocaust?
"Scholars have debated how Christian antisemitism may have played a role in the Nazi Third Reich, World War II and the Holocaust."
The one thing we can believe is that before he formulated the Church, he persecuted Nazarenes, as an employee of the Sadducees. No Pharisee would ever work for the Sadducees.
From Wikipedia -
According to the writings in the New Testament, Paul was known as Saul prior to his conversion, and was dedicated to the persecution of the early disciples of Jesus in the area of Jerusalem.[Acts 8:1]
There is a Christian tradition that Paul was a tent-maker by trade. I was not able to find any verse in the New Testament to establish the reality of this claim but a Christian friend of mine helped me out.
"After these things Paul departed from Athens, and came to Corinth; And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy, with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart from Rome:) and came unto them. And because he was of the same craft, he abode with them, and
wrought: for by their occupation they were tent-makers."
Acts 18:1-3 KJV
This is the sole verse telling us that Paul was at some point in his life, a tent-maker, or possibly that he came from a family in Tarsus who were tent-makers. There is also a Christian oral tradition that it was Paul's father who was the tent-maker for the Roman army, and that is how he obtained Roman citizenship.
Be that as it may, what is evident is that Paul's job, before he became a Christian, was that of policeman, hired by the Sadducees to track down and jail Jewish messianists who were seen as a potential problem for Jews in their relations with the Roman government.
He moved from a relatively peaceful occupation to become a law enforcer. I can only think that the law fascinated him, and not only questions of law but, having a strong police mentality, a commitment to make sure that people obeyed the law. I speculate that Paul's status as a Roman citizen made him feel proud and ensured his
loyalty to the Empire, and what better way to express that loyalty than to go after those whom he considered law breakers or outlaws, and Jews who actively engaged in activities or who expressed sympathy with those who engaged in activities to bring about a new Empire [Kingdom of Heaven] with a new Jewish Emperor [messiah]. Although the editors of the Christian scriptures want to characterize Christians as the only messianists persecuted by the Empire and by Sadducean leadership, the truth is that there were many messianic groups in operation and Paul probably pursued all of them. It's just that when he had his epiphany on his way to bring back Nazarenes from Damascus to Jerusalem for trial, it was a vision of a heavenly Yeshua that he experienced. After his epiphany, he had to spend time in isolation to sort out what the vision was all about.
Paul quit his job as cop and retired to "Arabia" [Galatians 1:17], probably meaning Transjordan for about a decade where he slowly evolved his ideas about who and what Yeshua was and why he was chosen to have the vision. In was then that he transformed a real Jewish teacher, Yeshua, into the god Jesus.
I stated that Paul was fascinated by law. In fact, law was his obsession, and the breaking of law he considered the most abominable and atrocious thing a person could do. No doubt he had little difficulty obeying the law of the Empire. It was RELIGIOUS law, TORAH, with which he appears to have had extreme difficulty.
He confesses as much in his first letter sent to gentiles in Rome who had come into contact with Jewish messianists, probably Nazarenes, and were drawn to them and their belief that a messiah had come and would soon put an end to history and to their suffering.
"I had not known sin except by the TORAH: for I had not known lust, except the TORAH had said, Thou shalt not covet. But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the TORAH sin was dead. For I was alive without the TORAH once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me. And even if the TORAH is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good, was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful. For we know that the TORAH is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I. If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the TORAH that it is good.
Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. I find then a TORAH, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. For I delight in the TORAH of God after the inward man: But I see another TORAH in my members, warring against the TORAH of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the TORAH of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the TORAH of God; but with the flesh the TORAH of sin.
This is quite a self-revealing testimony.
Paul's statement that he was alive without the TORAH once is confusing. Was he a convert? He says that he was a Pharisee but that is probably just another one of his lies. Paul applied for a policeman's job with the Sadducees who were bitter enemies of the Pharisees. How could he work for the enemies of a group in which he claimed membership? As in all of his statements, he simply cannot be believed about anything, much less of the truth of Christianity.
"The Nazarenes, who were the first followers of Jesus, rejected all the Epistles of Paul and regarded him as an imposter. They reported, among other things, that he was originally a pagan; that he came to Jerusalem where he lived some time; and that having a mind to marry the daughter of a high priest, he caused himself to be circumcised." (The Age of Reason’ by Thomas Paine, p. 167) "Christianity is the result of love affair between Popea and Paul, which had failed."
Source: - http://www.answering-christianity.com/abdullah_smith/invention_of_christianity.htm
Whether Paul actually was or was not a convert is not the issue here. The fact that there is a tradition to that effect, stemming from the writings of the original Jewish followers of Yeshua, is an issue. It shows that the original Jewish followers of Yeshua held Paul in such contempt that they made his conversion based upon his desire to possess the KOHEN GADOL's daughter. Such a conversion is invalid according to Jewish law.
Paul reveals his weakness. He is too weak to obey the law of God given to the Jewish People. Most Jews understand that their observance of MITSVOT is far from perfect but they don't give in to the kind of despair that Paul gave into; they are not depressed and overcome with a sense of personal spiritual failure that he expresses.
He states "I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing!" I really have never met any Jew who considered his own flesh to be the residence of nothing good. Paul's confession of his carnal weakness is echoed elsewhere when he writes:
"And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me."
2 Corinthians 12:7
Many have speculated what this thorn in the flesh might be and speculation has led to strong theories that Paul is talking about homosexual feelings that he cannot ignore.
From Wikipedia -
There are three verses in the New Testament that purportedly contain explicit references to homosexuality and are found within letters attributed to Paul.
Romans 1:26-27: "Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion."
1 Corinthians 6:9: "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders."
1 Timothy 1:8-11: "We know that the TORAH is good if one uses it properly. We also know that the TORAH is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality."
The TORAH may have been made with homosexuals in mind as well as other desecrators of the law and the TORAH condemns homosexuality.
"'If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."
We don't know if, in the first Christian century, Jews were literally killing homosexuals but the fact that the TORAH mandates the death penalty for it was sufficient for Paul to feel that he deserved death, if that was what was bothering him.
Imagine a man committed to the law to the extent that he becomes a cop only to find that he himself is a criminal when it comes to the TORAH. All Jews are but we don't create a new religion without law to escape our nature. We take responsibility for our failures, something that if the followers of Jesus Christ had done for two thousand years, history would have been different. Certainly Jewish history would have been different.
But Paul generalized his own weakness and projected it upon the mass of humanity. If he was weak, so was everyone else, and human weakness cannot be helped by the TORAH. The TORAH only highlights human weakness. So then why was it given in the first place, accordingto Paul?
"Why, then, was the TORAH given at all? It was added because of transgressions until [Christ to whom the promise referred had come. The TORAH was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator. A mediator, however, implies more than one party; but God is one. Is the TORAH, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not! For if a TORAH had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the TORAH. But Scripture has locked up everything under the control of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe."
The message is- You can't obey the TORAH so don't try. In fact, God only gave the TORAH through the agency of angels to show man how incapable and what a miserable sinner he is. The real TORAH, according to Paul, is Christ - who can forgive and overcome all your sins by his death which atoned for all sins for all times. All you have to do is believe that Jesus Christ is your savior [messiah]. Aside from the fact that the Jewish religion has never taught that the messiah dies to save you from your sins, it never taught that the messiah is a god come down to earth in human form. But Christianity does posit that. Paul's ideas never got to evolve quite to the point of making Jesus God but he came close.
"Christ who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped."
Philippians 2:6 - English Standard Version (©2001)
"Though he was God, he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to".
Philippians 2:6 - New Living Translation
There is a slight difference or nuance but it is a short step away from what Christianity's idea of Jesus ultimately did evolve into, namely, that Jesus is not only Christ [messiah]; he is also savior, son of God, and finally a form of God - so he is God to Christians, a god who takes human form, lives among people, and dies and is resurrected in order to eternally atone for the sins of people who accept him as such. Even Jews have to accept him in order to be "saved". But Jews mistakenly believe that they are different from the rest of humanity; they believe that they are OK just adhering to the TORAH and so they have ignored Jesus for over two thousand years, the penalty for which appears to be Auschwitz.
But the theme of a dying and rising god was a major element of Middle Eastern pagan religion. These include Ugaritic Baal, Melqart-Heracles, Adonis-Tammuz, and Osiris. And then there is Attis:
Attis was born on December 25th of the Virgin Nana.
He was considered the savior who was slain for the salvation of mankind.
His body as bread was eaten by his worshipers.
His priests were "eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven."
He was both the Divine Son and the Father.
On "Black Friday," he was crucified on a tree, from which his holy blood ran down to redeem the earth.
He descended into the underworld.
After three days, Attis was resurrected on March 25th (as tradition held of Jesus) as the "Most High God."
Attis was represented as a "a man tied to a tree, at the foot of which was a lamb, and, without doubt also as a man nailed to a tree..."
Source - http://www.tektonics.org/copycat/attis.html
Attis was worshiped as a deity in what is known today as modern Turkey, with his cult later spreading throughout the Roman Empire. And guess what? Paul was born in a gentile city that was heavily influenced by Mystic Cults and gods such as Attis. A temple to Attis existed in Tarsus during the time of Paul.
Here's another interesting thing to consider. When missionaries go after gentiles to convert them, they present Jesus as the savior, the son of God, and God. They DON'T present him as the MESSIAH because gentiles don't relate to messianism the way Jews do. Messiah is a concept that is not important to gentiles who live in the present.
Jesus will really only be the messiah when he comes and issues in the Kingdom of heaven, the messianic age. And the average Christian is as eager for that to happen as is the average Jew. Come but not today. Today I am busy making a living and acquiring stuff.
Ok, so now we know enough about the creator of Christianity to tell missionaries to go bother non-Jews. And it's enough to let them know that what their creator says about Jews and Jewish religion today is considered hate speech. So why would we want to be one of them? But what about the main character of the piece, J man himself?
Well let's examine a few facts to add icing to the cake.
We say that the missionary wants Jews to stop ignoring Jesus and accept him as the messiah. OK. So lets talk about what kind of a JEWISH messiah Jesus is, not Yeshua the real Jewish person who taught TORAH to the AM-HA'ARETSIM of Galilee, but the dream-man who floats through the texts of the gospels as the Christ of a gentile religion about a "king of the Jews".
I'll begin with the Gospel according to Mark since it is the first written gospel in the NT. Mark was composed about the year 70 CE.
"And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him. And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance ......... And it came to pass, that he went through the corn fields on the sabbath day; and his disciples began, as they went, to pluck the ears of corn. And the Pharisees said unto him, Behold, why do they on the sabbath day that which is not lawful? And he said unto them, Have ye never read what David did, when he had need, and was an hungred, he, and they that were with him? How he went into the house of God in the days of Abiathar the high priest, and did eat the shewbread, which is not lawful to eat but for the priests, and gave also to them which were with him? And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Throughout the gospels there is a running theme of Jesus at odds with Jewish religious leadership. In these verses, that mutual antipathy appears for the first time and they are instructive of the Christian attitude towards rabbis in general. "Scribes and Pharisees" are the ones who ultimately became THE Jewish leaders and preserved the Jewish People for all time after the disastrous war with Rome in which Jews as a people might have been wiped out. Here is the so-called messiah of the Jews, unrecognized as such by the very people most conversant with the prophecies concerning the messiah. Jesus is a compassionate messiah who mingles with the disenfranchised while the Pharisees are hard-hearted men who look down on the unwashed peasants. Variations on this theme-story run throughout the gospels and they don't need repeating.
The setup by Mark is that the messiah appears to the downtrodden and Jewish religious leaders are too blind to know who he is. Not only that but the Pharisees don't understand what the sabbath is all about and they are not familiar with the idea of PEKUACH NEFESH, that the saving of a life supersedes the prohibitions of sabbath.
Summing up, Jewish leaders are blind, uncompassionate, and religiously ignorant.
Ask the missionary why a Jew would want to accept a messiah who insults rabbis? His response is, whether he states it or not, that modern day Jewish religious leaders are doing the same thing to Jews that they did back in the day. They are keeping the truth from Jews, and thereby keeping Jews in a state of blindness and religious ignorance. He will not admit that this attitude is what we call antisemitic.
"And the Pharisees went forth, and straightway took counsel with the Herodians against him, how they might destroy him."
From the beginning, Mark is setting up the idea that the rabbis are not only blind; they are malevolent, wanting to kill their own messiah. Ask the missionaries if Jews are Christ-killers. There is no telling how he will react but why does a Jew want to accept a messiah that is so distasteful to rabbis that they want to kill him before he has a chance to do something useful? So they conspire with the Jewish head of state, the king and his family, to get rid of him. So the rabbis are not the only ones at fault. The Jewish king Herod also doesn't acknowledge who J is.
"And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils."
[see also - Matthew 9:34 "But the Pharisees said, He casteth out devils through the prince of the devils." and - Matthew 12:24 "But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils."]
Oh yeah. The rabbis recognize that Jesus can perform miracles but that's only because he is in league with the devil. Ask the missionaries if that is how Jews will respond to the real messiah? Why accept a messiah that inspires so much hatred in our rabbis?
"There came then his brethren and his mother, and, standing without, sent unto him, calling him. And the multitude sat about him, and they said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren without seek for thee. And he answered them, saying, Who is my mother, or my brethren? And he looked round about on them which sat about him, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!"
Ask the missionaries why you should accept a messiah who is disrespectful to his family, especially his mother; one who ignores the fifth commandment [Exodus 20:12].
Let me make a point about Mark. I said that Mark wrote his gospel at about 70 CE, 4 years after the Romans defeated the first Jewish rebellion. The reason he wrote that gospel is really to show the Romans that Christians are loyal subjects of Caesar, not rebellious Jews. The way he does this in his gospel is to separate Jesus from his Jewishness as much as possible, to let the Romans know that although Jesus was Jewish he accounted it as SKUBALA.
"And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: [and the Jews said] Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him. But Jesus, said unto them, A prophet is not without honor, but in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house."
Why do you want to accept a messiah who says that anyone can see how great he is except the damn, wretched Jews who are actually OFFENDED by him? Now it's no longer only the Pharisees. It's the folk of his own town.
"Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashed hands? He answered and said unto them, ..... For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition."
This verse gives Christians in general and missionaries in particular a basis to tell Jews that the whole rabbinic tradition on how to perform the commandments of the TORAH is wrong and counter to what God wants. The Jewish religion is based on its own interpretive logic, that is, a rabbinically handed down way to interpret what the TORAH says and expects. The tradition eventually wound up as the TALMUD. Jesus further infuriates the rabbis by condemning the Jewish way of being religious. Of course Christians had no access to the rabbinic tradition, being gentiles, and since Paul had told them that the TORAH was invalid anyway, why should they bother to inquire about it anyway. It set the tone for Christians calling Judaism "legalistic", a term of insult to rabbis and Judaism.
Ask your not so friendly missionary why should you accept a messiah who calls the way you worship God an impediment to worship and contradictory to what God expects?
He'll probably respond by saying that the TALMUDIC tradition is just another way that the rabbis prevent Jews from the knowledge of the "truth."It's just another example of Christian hubris, to say they know better than Jews how to perform commandments given only to Jews.
"And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ. And he charged them that they should tell no man of him."
Ask - Why do Jews want to accept a messiah that comes and tells his followers not to tell the Jews that he is here? What's that about?
Next I'll look at the Gospel according to Matthew, the second gospel in the NT, composed about the year 80 CE when the Nazarenes were competing with the Pharisees for the loyalty of the Jewish People but were not having too much success.
"Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven. Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
Why do Jews want to accept a messiah that insults Jews giving TSADAKAH in synagogues?
"And when Jesus was entered into Capernaum, there came unto him a centurion, beseeching him, And saying, Lord, my servant lieth at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented. And Jesus saith unto him, I will come and heal him. The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed. For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it. When Jesus heard it, he marveled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness:".
These verses are perhaps the most insidious verses in the gospels when it comes to Jews. The antisemitism is subtle so for any Jew contemplating Jesus as the messiah, let me clarify what Matthew is saying.
A Roman officer comes to ask Jesus a favor, that he heal his servant. Remember, this man is a military commander of an occupying power that has dominated the Land of Israel and the Jewish People. Jesus turns to those who are his followers, ostensibly Jews that no Jew [NONE] has as much faith as this uncircumcised dog. Wow! He then follows that insult up with another, greater one, that many gentiles will come from all over the world and will be with Abraham in the Kingdom of Heaven but the Jews [children of the kingdom] will be cast away. And remember, Matthew is supposed to be the only JEWISH evangelist. Well, why would you as a Jew want to accept a messiah who has a greater love and appreciation of gentiles [occupiers at that] than he does of Jews, who doesn't seem to mind that his own country is being occupied by a non-Jewish army, and that you, along with the rest of Israel, will be cast away at the end of time?
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."
Wait a minute! I thought the whole reason for the messiah's coming is to bring peace! Right? The whole beating swords into shears thing? Lions and lambs sleeping together? Ask the dopey missionary how a sane Jew can accept a messiah who wants the opposite?
And by the way, I love music, all music, even Christmas carols. However, there is one carol that drives me crazy, the one called O Holy Night - because in it the lyric says: "Chains shall He break for the slave is our brother. And in his name all oppression shall cease."
Are you kidding me? In the past two thousand years, since the coming of the MAMZER, oppression has INCREASED, and increased EXACTLY IN HIS NAME. He was as good as his word. He did bring, not peace, but a sword to the world, and especially to the Jewish People. Ask the missionary why Christians lie to nonChristians.
The 23rd chapter of Matthew is probably the most anti-Jewish in the whole gospel. It is an merciless, arrogant, self-righteous attack on our religious leaders, and by implication, on our religion. Rather than quote the entire chapter which you can read for yourselves at the local library, I cite a few verses to give you the flavor of the Jew-hatred fouling this Jew-hating book.
13 "But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in."
27 "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness."
28 "Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity."
33 "Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?"
If nothing else about Jesus has so far turned you off, then maybe these verses will begin to show you that the J man is no messiah of Jews, and is in, fact, a mean-spirited, nasty antisemite whom Jews rightly consigned to the garbage heap of Jewish history.
"Then were gathered together the chief priests, and the elders of the people, unto the court of the high priest, who was called Caiaphas; and they took counsel together that they might take Jesus by subtlety, and kill him."
"Now when morning was come, all the chief priests and the elders of the people took counsel against Jesus to put him to death:"
A graphic example of Christianity's charge that Jews are Christ-killers, and not even honest, outright ones; they want to kill him sneakily [by subtlety]. If he was so bad that we wanted to kill him, then why now worship him, and although Christ-killing is not factual but a Christian falsity, why accept a religion that says that Jews are the enemy?
"Now when they were going, behold, some of the watch came into the city, and shewed unto the chief priests all the things that were done. And when they were assembled with the elders, and had taken counsel, they gave large money unto the soldiers, Saying, Say ye, His disciples came by night, and stole him away while we slept. And if this come to the governor's ears, we will persuade him, and secure you. So they took the money, and did as they were taught: and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day."
This is a greater calumny even than Christ-killing. In effect, Matthew says that the Jewish religious leaders actually KNEW that Jesus had risen from the dead but paid the authorities to withhold this information from the people and lie to them. Is that what will happen when the real messiah comes? At any rate, it's an insult to Jews and you must tell the missionary that you don't want to keep on hearing abut how evil and diabolical your leaders are.
Next let's see the Gospel according to Luke, the third written gospel in the NT, composed about the year 90 CE, written by a Greek gentile, supposedly the friend and interpreter of Paul the Apostate. Luke has less of a bone of contention to pick with Jews than the two previous evangelists and the anti-Jewish stuff in his gospel is rather toned down but nevertheless it exists, maybe subtley.
Consider this parable found in chapter 16.
"There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
There's a lot here. A sinner in hell asks Abraham to send one of the blessed dead to his family to warn them to change their evil ways so that they do not wind up also in hell - because surely, the family will belief someone who has come back from the dead to testify about what happens to people who are not saved from damnation. Abraham's response is much like the on-going anti-Jewish responses of the J man himself. 1. Jews don't pay heed either to what Moses had to say or what the later prophets have to say so why should they pay head to anyone else, even someone having had a death experience? Jews don't listen to anyone for their own good. And it's ABRAHAM WHO IS NOW TESTIFYING AGAINST HIS OWN DESCENDANTS! The reference to someone coming back from the dead whom the Jews don't believe is obviously Jesus himself.
Jews don't believe him because they don't even believe Moses. Why would Jews want to accept as messiah someone who so insults Jews, using their own religious heroes to do so?
Lastly let's look at the Gospel according to John, the fourth written gospel in the NT, composed about the year 100 CE when Christianity was already a separate gentile religion putting itself in direct competition with Judaism to attract converts. This gospel is without doubt the most virulently antisemitic of all gospels and maybe the most antisemitic book in the whole New Testament, and therefore one that we should pay close attention to in refuting missionaries.
"He came unto his own, and his own received him not."
There is no verse more painful to Christians than this one. It spells the failure of Christianity and it's the driving force for missionaries to try to convert Jews.
Some people think that Jews reject Jesus. They don't. They do worse. They IGNORE him. To Christians, Jesus Christ is the be-all and the end-all to their lives. They cannot see living a life without him. There are documented reports about Christians losing their faith- their belief - in Jesus, and many of these people go into a deep depression and state of mourning over the loss of faith - so emotionally central is he in their lives. It's incomprehensible to them that anyone can exist without him, especially the very people from whom he sprang. Jesus is supposedly King of the Jews, and yet his subjects are gentiles. Something is wrong as far as they are concerned. Missionaries may tell Jews that they are incomplete without Jesus. The truth of the matter is the reverse. Their whole religious system and their theology is incomplete without the acceptance of him by Jews. As one Christian theologian put it, "The existence of the Synagogue side by side with the church is an ontological impossibility, a wound, a gaping hole in the body of Christ, something which is quite intolerable." - Karl Barth [Quoted in "Jesus then & now: images of Jesus in history and Christology" by Marvin W. Meyer. Intolerable is the word, so much so that Christians killed Jews rather than let them live without Christ.
John's gospel had to explain to the newly converted gentiles why the very people of their new savior were outside the church. He did a fine job and filled his gospel with hatred. Just a few verses will suffice to show why no self-respecting Jew will want any part of belief in the Nazarene magician, according to whose scripture
"casteth out devils through the prince of the devils".
"And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come."
Wow. What a way to treat your mother! Real honor. Do Jews really need a messiah who breaks the Ten Commandments? If he can't treat his own mom well, how would he treat the rest of us?
"The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole. And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day. But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God."
So a man whom Jesus healed reported to "THE Jews". In the New Testament, much is made of definite article usage. THE implies ALL. THE [all] Jews sought to slay him. Here the Christ-killer theme is already hard at work, informing the mindset of Christians, especially their children who pass the animus down the generations. Ask why a Jew would like a messiah who himself calls Jews Christ-killers. I said that Paul had never actually definitively said that Christ was God - but in this gospel, the identification is already in place. Jewish tradition never said that the messiah would be God. If that would be the case, then there is no need for a messiah to come. God has always been there so why do we need Him to take another form and be a messiah?
"The Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honor from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honor one of another, and seek not the honor that cometh from God only? Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?"
It gets worse. THE [all] Jews not only refuse to believe in the magician. How can they? They don't even believe in the TORAH [Moses]. And why? They have not the love of God in them. They don't love God and God doesn't love them. Apparently God loves the whole world minus Israel. No Jew needs a messiah like that.
"But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me except it were given unto him of my Father. From that time many of his disciples went back and walked no more with him."
Tell the missionary not to bother with you since the magician has said that if God wishes, a person will come to Jesus. That you are not coming is because God doesn't want you to come.
"Did not Moses give you the TORAH, and yet none of you keepeth the TORAH? Why go ye about to kill me? The people answered and said, Thou hast a devil: who goeth about to kill thee? Jesus answered and said unto them, I have done one work, and ye all marvel. Moses therefore gave unto you circumcision; (not because it is of Moses, but of the fathers;) and ye on the sabbath day circumcise a man."
This is confusing even for me. Aside from the fact that it is more antisemitic trash, what is J saying? No Jew keeps the TORAH? Moses ordered circumcision? No, God ordered Abraham to circumcise. But then, Moses didn't order circumcision but it's only a custom [of the fathers]? I don't know what the man is saying and he didn't know what he was saying. Anyway, he had a devil within him so who needs a messiah who sounds confused and is infected by a demon?
"Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him ........ I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you. I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father. They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God. Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil? Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by."
Just as the 23rd chapter is the most antisemitic in Matthew, so is the 8th chapter of John similarly the most antisemitic.
The verses above contain several interesting themes which show extreme antipathy, actually hatred, between Jews and the false messiah.
First of all, Jesus is speaking to JEWS WHO [HAD] BELIEVED ON HIM. Imagine what he would have to say abut Jews who don't. The theme of Jews wanting to kill him intensifies. There are also back and forth accusations of J being of the devil. Previously Jesus condemns Jews for not following Moses and now he says that Jews are
not even really children of Abraham. The Jews listening to him not only say that he is possessed by a devil but that he is a Samaritan which is saying that he is
not a real Jew. Jesus escalates the argument saying that he is co-equal with God [Before Abraham was, I am] which leads those Jews present to attempt to kill him on the spot. Using logic and what we expect from a real messiah, do we need a messiah with whom there is such hateful interaction? What good would such a messiah be?
"Then gathered the chief priests and the Pharisees a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many miracles. If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation. And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all, Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not."
The Jewish religious leaders plot to kill the messiah who is supposed to save Jews from the Romans. Is this serious or stupid?
"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. This he said, signifying what death he should die. The people answered him, We have heard out of the TORAH that Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of man?"
The ordinary Jews, not the leaders, say that Jewish scriptures prophecy that the messiah lives forever and they ask him why HE is saying that messiah must die.
Obviously the Christian scripture doesn't follow the Jewish ones. So why believe in them?
"But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them."
If I understand these verses right, according to Christian scriptures, God has determined that the eyes of the Jewish People will be religiously blind so they cannot recognize the messiah when he comes. Now just ask the missionary why God would do that unless He does not want Jews to accept Jesus, and if so, why is he bothering Jews with this nonsense?
"Then Pilate entered into the judgment hall again, and called Jesus, and said unto him, Art thou the King of the Jews? Jesus answered him, Sayest thou this thing of thyself, or did others tell it thee of me? Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Thine own nation and the chief priests have delivered thee unto me: what hast thou done? Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence."
Jesus is arrested [finally, after all his senseless prattling] and brought before the Roman governor who asks him if he is the messiah. The conversation is interesting and totally insane if this is a messiah. Pilate says that Jesus' OWN PEOPLE and their religious leaders have brought him to judgment, and then the J man declares that if he is a messiah, he is not a messiah for our world and that certainly not one for THE Jews because J's real followers COULD help him fight against and be delivered from THE Jews! If this is any type of messiah that Jews expect, the world is absolutely crazy. Tell the missionary that you don't want Jesus's servants coming after you any more and throwing you in the oven! Thanks for nothing!
"Then came Jesus forth, wearing the crown of thorns, and the purple robe. When the chief priests therefore and officers saw him, they cried out, saying, Crucify him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Take ye him, and crucify him: for I find no fault in him. The Jews answered him, We have a law, and by our law he ought to die, because he made himself the Son of God."
The evangelist who wrote these lines was an idiot and an antisemite. No Jewish leader would encourage Romans to execute a Jew, and the charge is spurious. There is neither a law nor a reason to kill someone who says he is the son of God. Christians call themselves the sons and daughters of God. But the verses are an intensification of antisemitism and intensify the reason to tell the missionary to bug off.
I've come to the end of my arguments that a Jew can present to a missionary. Currently the missionary urge to Jews is not as great as it was in the last decades of the 20th century and the media is no longer covering any Jews For Jesus hype. In fact, so-called Messianic-Judaism [Hebrew-Christianity] has become an overwhelmingly gentile religious expression. However there still are some attempts by Christians to convert Jews, but my opinion is that the tired, old methods of rebuttal such as practiced by Tuvia Singer are ineffective and can't be used by the average Jew untrained in engaging in religious disputation. And, as I pointed out at the beginning of this essay, these methods involve defending our scriptures. As I stated above, you can download his lectures at http://torahanytime.com/rabbi_singer.html. They are really informative and interesting only in an academic sense. My method of attack on THEIR scriptures is to the point. Each of these verses can be presented and no further argument is necessary. The verses say what they say.
Always remember why missionaries feel a need to convert Jews so much. Kark Barth said it best when he said that Christianity minus the presence of the Jewish People is an incomplete theology. Although most modern Christians have come to understand that Judaism is a valid religion and that Jews don't need any other religion, enthusiastic, proselytizing Christians have a pre-modern mindset. They take their scriptures seriously, and their scriptures tell them that they NEED THE ACCEPTANCE OF JESUS CHRIST BY JEWS as a sine qua non for their eschatology to move towards completion. They may say that Jews are incomplete without Jesus but the reality is that Jesus and his religion are incomplete without Jews.
But look at Christianity from a completely Jewish point of view. What is it but a SECOND-HAND religion. If the Jewish religion is for Jews a golden goblet, Christianity is for Jews a plastic cup. There may be two testaments, the true testament and the DE-testament. As to the New Testament, we say that whatever there is in it that's true is not new and whatever there is in it that's new is not true.
Finally, remember Paul's statement - Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. - Galatians 5:2 QED!
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